I met with Barbara on March 19th at her house in NW DC. I originally met Barbara at the doors of First Congregational Church at 10th and G. Bob and I had just moved down from New York City after I graduated from Union Theological Seminary and Bob from Columbia School of Social Work. First Church was (and, unfortunately, continues to be) the only Open and Affirming church in Washington, D.C. I started with First Church in my quest to find a new church home because of its theological and political stand on inclusiveness.

At First Church, I found Barbara and John, both graduates of Union Seminary, who welcomed us and began guiding me in the in-care process for ordination. I clung to Barbara 1998 because of her pastoral skills. The transition out of Union was nothing other than shitty for me. I was now without a community, void of friendships that were full of depth and intensity, and I felt invisible in D.C. Since Bob grew up in the D.C. area, I felt like my only identity at that point was "This is Ashley, Bob's girlfriend." Lovely but not enough. I was in D.C. feeling totally invisible; not seen in the present.

Barbara helped me navigate the murky and rocky waters of life after Union.

So it should not have surprised me that it took me a whole five minutes to get weepy with Barbara on March 19th. I was instantly transported back to 1998 and that fragile emotional state. But my emotions helped to set the stage for me to listen to Barbara share her full emotions in her "steppingstones" of life.

I've given each of my interviewees a reflection exercise called "Steppingstones." It was created by Ira Progroff as a means to getting to the major experiences in life. For our interview, I asked Barbara to reflect on her significant life relationships and experiences.

You can hear excerpts from our interview, with Barbara starting off with the "personal is political" as key steppingstones that took her to seminary and beyond. These excerpts include: Barbara talk about being a 60's child, a feminist, being in a women's consciousness raising group at Union, doing clergy consultation around choice in Scranton, PA, the demoralizing sexism she experienced at her first call, her bi-vocation as pastor and artist. We end the interview with Barbara reflecting on theological concepts that mean the most to her right now. It's about 20 minutes long in this order: Barbara's political steppingstones plus her consciousness raising group at Union. My voice sounds muffled and I'll fix that for the next interview. The interview also abruptly due to editing issues (my issues, not software issues. If you ask me about these issues, be sure to have a drink in hand....for me ).

Barbara's emotions were right there on top as she described the fierce sexism she faced in Scranton, the grief from feeling invisible in the Church.

The emotions that came from Barbara's story and my own emotions were palpable. Throughout our conversation, Barbara kept coming back to words that touch on my own story: transitions, being seen in the present, community, friendships based on shared humanity, and the personal is political. As we were talking, surrounded by this sturdy, wooden coffee table (pictured to the right) it became evident to why I picked these specific ten women to interview: they are all intense, political, authentic, and share their deepest selves with me, calling me forth to explore my own interior.


As I drove away from Barbara's house, down 16th street, I found myself right in front of the White House, a significant reminder of my hometown and where I live. In 1998, D.C. felt like less than home; it felt like a bottomless, empty pit. I certainly had my own grief work to do. This is when I met Barbara and now I come to her, in the midst of her own Great Labor called grief work. But now, with Barack Obama, I call this place home. Even though I'm not living in the muckity-muck of transition anymore, I'll still take any invitation to cling to Barbara Gerlach.

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In the interview, Barbara mentioned a NYTimes article done on her co-pastoring with John in Scranton, PA. I did an advanced search on NYTimes and found the article. I also found the article announcing Barbara's marriage to John, with the caption underneath her picture claiming she is the "former Barbara Gerlach." Barbara had changed her named when they were married but after many "trigger moments" of feeling invisible due to the name change, she changed her name back to Barbara Gerlach. When Barbara changed her name back to Gerlach, her mom asked her sister, "what will the mailman think?" The articles are below.

Barbara's Wedding Picture
Article of Barbara and John